5 Tips for More Natural Engagement on Instagram

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All right guys. So today's episode is all about Instagram. Raise your hand if you love Instagram. I know you can't see me because this is a podcast but my hand is raised high because I'm a big fan of Instagram. It's where I spend most of my time on social media. I love the aesthetics of it. I love the visual aspects of it and I love the interaction that I get on Instagram. I know this since Instagram and Facebook are owned by the same companies. Now there's been some changes that have been made with advertising and marketing and the algorithm.


But I think that our guest today is going to help us break through all of that so that we can love Instagram even more. Today I'm chatting with Charlese from the girl at the yellow desk. She has a really interesting story about how she went from owning her own salon and being a hairdresser to being a virtual assistant and a content manager. She specializes in all things social media and especially Instagram. So we talk about a lot of things in this interview but we are covering for the most part five tips that will help you get more natural engagement and exposure on Instagram which is what we all want right.


We want to do a post to Instagram and have everybody see it like it comment on it share on it. All those things. So today she's sharing five really really great tips. In fact you're going to hear these are some things that even I was surprised about and really excited to start implementing. So I won't make you wait any longer. Let's jump into our interview with the girl at the yellow desk. Hi Shirley welcome to the grow means business podcast.


How are you today. Hi. I'm doing so great today. Thank you for having me. How are you. I'm doing wonderful. I'm so excited to chat with you today. We've got a really exciting topic I think a lot of people are going to be interested in but before we dive into Instagram tell us a little bit about you and who you are. Your story of how you got into what you're doing now all the things.


Oh thank you for asking. I would love to. My company is called Girl at the yellow desk. And before you ask the question I actually don't have a yellow desk yet but it's one of my favorite colors and my goal is to build a beautiful office home office with a giant yellow desk.


So you'll have to post pictures when you do because I want to see you.


I will. So we'll all know that I've gotten to my goal when you see the actual yellow dust but in the meantime I have actually been an entrepreneur for over 20 years in the beauty industry.


I have built multiple clients whole in different cities doing hair as a hairstylist behind the chair. I had a sole successful salon in a small town in Orange County for seven years where I operated with four stylists underneath me. And during that entire time it also educated for some of the top companies in the hair industry and so the courted their sales were working even with them. So for Saks Fifth Avenue Bloomingdale's and Nordstrom to help further their career. So that covered everything from marketing to sales to site psychology with clients.


So I definitely worked with people and been in the industry but unfortunately last December of that was twenty eighteen. So a year ago I had emergency back surgery and Jo back surgery. I was unable to continue doing hair behind the chair. I did close my salon. I decided instead of looking at it as giving up on something I kind of felt for you to now suddenly explore what I really wanted to do which was work where I wanted to work and travel. And I had a coaching call with someone who said why can't you do the same thing that you did behind the chair.


But instead of doing hair help women in a different way with your knowledge and expertise and giant light bulb went off and I knew I had found my new purpose and maybe my purpose my whole life was leading to this moment. I definitely feel grounded in that decision. So I'm honing into different systems learning different things that I thought I knew and maybe didn't know so well. So it's a little different to be in front of a computer every day. But I am so happy I get the same excitement when I give a female entrepreneur the confidence to go out and pull up her business with my tips and my hope on some of her projects.


It's like the same feeling that when a client would walk out of the salon and know that six weeks they are going to feel beautiful that they could take over the world. It's that same confidence and peace that I'm giving them when they get my email sequences or my Instagram already taken care of. So that's basically what I do now and I am I couldn't be happier in my job.


I love that and I love that everybody's journey is so unique in that year. You said you know that you feel like you're kind of coming into what you were meant to do. And that's exactly how I felt when I left the classroom even though I'm technically still educating just a different way. You know you're still empowering women and encouraging them just in a different way. So love it. What are the amazing story.


Thank you. You know I really believe that women empower other women and for all of next to each other then we can all get everything that we want and that's what I'm here to do for women in business.


Yeah it's funny.


I was actually just at my hair salon yesterday getting my hair done and I was there today giving my lashes done but the owner of the salon I've been meaning to get her on the podcast cause she's amazing and she's built this incredible salon but I was chatting with her and you know I just said I was like I love coming in here because you've created this place where women feel incredible and they leave feeling incredible. And she like that's all. That's my only goal is to help people feel amazing. And I left there and right as I was leaving I I checked my phone real quick on Instagram and I saw somebody that I know that has started a brand new business.


It's a jewelry company but. And watching her post about her success and this now is like that's true it is like the way that I felt leaving the salon your shirt my hair done my lashes then to day like I feel like I can take on the world. I mean I get that excited when I see somebody who has listened to this podcast or has mentors with me or worked with me and they're doing incredible things. It's such an amazing feeling. So I totally understand that feeling that you have and I love that you're getting to do what you want to do now.


That's that's incredible.


Thank you. And you know when I can see you and you look beautiful so. That.


I'm alive. I love it.


So we talked a little bit before we had record and I kind of asked you what your title is I know that a lot of people referred to like virtual assistant B.A. but you said that you know you don't feel that you necessarily are just a B.A. because you do you are kind of each down you have specific things you focus on. So tell us a little bit what is it that you focus on and how do you help other women in business succeed.


Awesome. Great question. Thank you. You know I do consider myself a virtual assistant in the realm of the fact that I work virtually and I assist people but other than that I focus on content creation especially with social media management and email sales sequences being able to get and capture of someone's voice and put it into their Instagram feed for them for a whole month so they don't even have to think about it all they have to do is engage and see all the likes and all of the comments coming in oh you know how freeing and exciting that is for a woman it was so busy because we all know we should be on Instagram we all know we should be doing these things to further our business but to not have to think about it.


My clients tell me oh my gosh you took care of that for me. I just the relief from not having to have the burden of thinking of that and the same thing goes with some of the clients I worked up creating content for their e-mails on. So I am a virtual assistant and creates content but specifically with social media and email email copywriting and I love that too because I know I'm coming for the photography world.


One of the things that I always told photographers was don't try to be a jack of all trades like figure out what you really love. Figure out what you're really good at and focus just on that. So I think specializing is really key. I mean just like going to a doctor you want to go to a doctor you know you want to go to some that's a specialist in the area that you're struggling with. So I think that's great that you have found kind of the area that you want to specialize in.


And I think people really need to understand too that when they're looking for a V.A. to find somebody that can focus on the needs that you have specifically you know like if you are like me I'm not the most organized person. Like I don't my brain doesn't function. I would love to be organized. I love the idea of being organized. I love seeing other people's organizational tips but when it comes to actually doing the work to stay organized. I'm terrible at it so I need somebody that can be organized for me.


So I know that's what I look for when I'm working with people. But yeah I think that's great. And so when someone comes to you you're saying hey I want you to take over my Instagram or I want you to help me with my email sales funnels. At what point would you say in someone's business should they start looking for outsourcing. I know that's a big question here a lot is when should outsource I know that it's an expense that you know when you're first starting out may seem like this big expense but it can really give you back time in your business.


So what advice do you have for someone who is maybe thinking about going into outsourcing or looking into a V.A. OK.


I love your question because the first thing that happened when I decided to open my salon was I sought free advice actually from the county in Orange County. They will set you up with a business expert for free if you're a female or another type of person who like less means money wise somebody can go and seek help. So I was really surprised and kind of a little offended at first because it was like Oh you're a woman in business you know you need help and I was like you know what we do as women that's the number one thing we don't like to ask for is.


And you know I. So this woman her name was Carrie. She was actually like volunteering because she loved helping women in business but she had written her own books she was a very successful businesswoman who was volunteering her time I was fortunate enough to get her anyway. The first thing she told me I had all of these questions how many to a business how do I know and it was like You know every entrepreneur has the same questions and Jack say to me you know first things first make a list. And by the way this was my first freebie when I first started out so I'm going to give you like the how to without the freebie it's a free freebie here.


  1. So Jeremy told me make a column down the center are aligned on the center you have two columns and on the right side. I want you to write all the things on your mind like a brain. What do you have to get done even on a daily basis for your household. Like write everything down. So she gave me like two minutes I wrote down you know laundry dishes and then I wrote down for the salon towels and marketing everything she said circle the ones that you hate. And I was like you know cleaning the toilets those things.


And when I circled them she said I could draw arrows now put them over to that first column and on the top of that column write the word delegates choose. So from now on your first priority is to delegate the things you don't want to do to someone else. And that included for me hiring a bookkeeper which is so scary because it's like I don't even have that much money. What do I need a bookkeeper for. What do you know how do I know anyway. So my advice is the same as Kerry's.


And I would add that it's never too soon to delegate. In fact what she told me was because my thought was the same as I hear from women all the time when I get to that point where I can afford it. Well we always are waiting for something. But let me tell you that if you budget in from the beginning your delegation for your business it will pay for itself. You will have the peace of mind to begin with. And if you hire the right person they help you make some money back and you get a return on your investment.


So for those women who are already in business and didn't budget it my second advice would be figure out a way to find the person that fits your first needs. Do the same delegation list but do it as far as like your needs for your business to grow and then find someone who can do those for you because the right person will pay for themselves. If you have the right e-mail funnel you're going to sell. My last client had me do her e-mail funnel 10 e-mail funnels and I'll be honest with you it's four hundred dollars so that is an investment but it's not the world's largest investment right.


She sold twenty five soft spots on her twelve hundred other mastermind within that week because of the e-mails until she invested him and it helped save her peace of mind. It made her a lot of money and she easily paid me for that. You know so yeah she wants to hire me for all of her e-mail funnels it from now. So that's my advice about delegating do it do it do it and find a way to do it.


Yeah I had someone tell me one time and first of all I'd say that was quite the return on investment for that client of yours because that's huge.


But I had someone tell me one time or maybe I heard it somewhere that said you need to focus on doing the things that only you can do so in your business there are certain things that only you can do. But there's some other things behind the scenes that you're not. Not that you can't do them but like I'm not great at certain things in my business and like I'm not great at copy. I'm just not like words I can talk to you all day long. But if you asked me to put it on paper it's it's like this brain block I can't do it.


The words just they I've guess I've worked with copy people in the past they'll send me the landing page wording whatever I'm just like man. That sounds so eloquent and they eloquent they did it in five minutes long. How is it. It's not that I can't do it but somebody else has that gift that talent. Why not utilize that you know insight I think that the idea investment can be a little scary up front. But again when you think about the fact that it can bring you so much more time it can bring you more freedom to do things that only you can do to bring in money and then it's going to bring in money.


I mean it's going to get a return on its investment. So I agree with you. I'm all about delegates and actually like that word better than outsourcing because outsourcing sounds so like you're sending it to a third world country.


Yes. You know and I do.


I think I have it take as I've thought about ever but on fiber. That Web site where it's like the. Yeah. And I've gone on there before I think I was looking for like some kind of graphic design something or other and it was all of these people from other countries and I was like OK this is why I think I have that mental block around the word outsourcing because I've always seen it as like you send it off to somebody and it comes back so impersonal it comes back. So not in your voice you know.


So you do it to find the right person.


Yeah I like the word delegate a lot but it was if you think about it delegate reminds us that as women we have power. So we are choosing to give something that we no longer want to do or can do because it'll take too much time to figure out how to do it to someone else. To me that's like one of the most powerful things because we all are getting into this business so that we can spend more time with our friends our family our babies whoever. So it's not about giving away power it's kind of about taking your power and standing in it.


Yeah. No I completely agree. And I and I love that I love the perspective you put on that. I'm gonna have to say this again I'm going to pull that clip out a reminder every day I'm in charge I'm.


I have the power I love it. Yeah OK. So let's dive into Instagram because that's what I'm sure a lot of you are excited to hear about. I know I'm gonna get into it. So you have five tips for us to help get more natural engagement and exposure on Instagram. I know you mentioned there's some changes at Instagram and so let's dive into those five tips. Awesome I love these tips are so exciting to me.


I know some people they're a little source of fear and frustration but for me it's like how can I get into the system and break it.


So now I love it. We can get over it together. Yeah. OK.


So one of the first things that I was taught and it's worked perfectly. It doesn't matter what the algorithm is doesn't matter what changes they make. Consistency. And I know that that's a hard one for a lot of people. You have to choose a plan which whether it's every day once a week three times a week ideally three to five times a week. You need to show up consistently. Your post should be posting. That's it. No excuses. Nothing. So if we're consistent then Instagram starts to realize this person's here to bring people to our platform and then they start to notice like OK people are engaging with this person and then the algorithm does start to favor you.


Not only that but it's that age old. I mean marketing ever since what we watched Mad Men it was in the 60s. You have to be in people's faces six to eight times before they even stop to say wait a minute what is this person about. So we really want to be as consistent as possible for me that's once a day every once in a while I take off the days you know I'm not feeling it and we all should if you need a break from Instagram do it give yourself peace of mind.


But generally speaking at least once a day we don't have to do more. And also the time of day no longer matters. Instagram has released something saying that even though they'll tell you on insights when people engage with you the most it doesn't matter the time of day doesn't matter. It goes in and it doesn't have anything to do with when people see your posts. So don't worry about when you're posting if it's like 11:00 p.m. and you're like dang it I was supposed to date you know when it posted 11:00 p.m. and posts from tomorrows to you have to just get it on once a day get that practice in.


So let me ask you real quick I like consistency. Yeah. Does that apply as well to stories. Because I know for me personally when I opened my Instagram the first thing I did before I scroll through the feed is I go through my stories. So does that need to be consistent to or can that be a little more sort of whenever it fits what's going on behind your behind the scenes on your brand. Yes. Actually you skipped ahead to a different tip so let's go on that one now. OK.


Instagram nerd with me that you're really thinking ahead and I love it. Don't do it we're going to geek out together.


We're going to go into this. OK. So when it comes to stories I'm consistency is also extremely important and you want to engage even more often you really want to be on a three to five times a day. Now the cool thing is is Facebook just released the fact that their content creator that works for Facebook now works for Instagram. The reason that's important is because a lot of people want to use planning for stories and for their feed through plan finally later those are all awesome tailwind except now Instagram is going to stop partnering with them and going to be.


I don't wanna see penalizing but in a way it's like penalizing you on your algorithm and your end B and being able to show up even for the people who want to see you by using those third party apps. So my point being that you don't have to be constantly pulling your phone out to show you a show your kids are doing. If you don't want to you can preplan your stories to come out throughout the day as well on content creator but you want to make sure that they are coming out several times a day and the biggest tip I once learned was when someone opens their Instagram because people open their Instagram like 50 times a day sometimes when someone opens their Instagram you want your circle to be one of the first two or three circles they see every single time they open.


The only way to do that is to post different times throughout the day and all of this posting whether it's on your feet or on your stories should be strategic. So you should be at the end of the day having a plan behind that whether that's nurturing people to get to know you whether that's selling something that you just released. There should always be some kind of purpose to your posting and some of it. Yes the food. Yes the new shoes you bought. Yes your kid making a mess in the kitchen.


Those are all part of your life so it's okay to share those and be there and laugh and get people to laugh with you or be excited about your shoes. But consistency all over the entire platform is important.


Yeah. One thing I heard that that really stuck with me one time was talking my Instagram Stories was everything you post should somehow relate to your brand. So like for me you know with my brand with my photography and even with the girl means business part of it it's all revolves around being a woman. Being a mom and wanting to feel good or wanting to do something for yourself whether it's a business or a photo shoot or whatever. So for me I feel like sharing my mom life is part of the brand.


So I don't have a problem with doing that but like with someone else was saying was I like you know if you're if you are your brand is you're a hairstylist and this and that don't always post pictures of your dog because that doesn't fit with your brands like you can do that all you want on your personal page. But if it has nothing to do with your brand then it needs to stay off of theirs. Do you agree with that.


Only to a certain degree. I think that your people pay you to do hair and not only to have good hair but because they care about you as a person. In fact someone will get a bad haircut 80 percent of the time from someone that they like so much of the actual hair statistics are 20 percent that people will leave someone for a bad haircut. It's it's more that they don't like the person anymore worse 80 percent that they don't like them so they will stick with a bad haircut because they like them so much so that being said how do you get someone to like you.


So yeah you might want to show your dog but not in every post right. You might want to say the reason why I cut hair is because I come home at night and this guy is waiting for me and I can cuddle with him at the end of a long day. Those sort of posts still are on brand for me. In fact I have a freebie that we're going to put I want you to give to everybody who's listening that talks about having a cohesive feed. So there's gonna be five major tips on ways that your feet including picking categories and really makes it easy instincts for people who are kind of lost in the How do I pick what to post what do I.


What do I do. This is actually going to give them the five top tips on how to make their seed and it applies to stories as well but their feed especially really cohesive so can we get to your listeners.


Yeah absolutely and I will link to that in the show notes so that everybody can click on the show notes and then I'll take them right to it. So they'll have easy. Yeah. Thank you. That's awesome.


Hey guys will you take a quick break from this incredible interview. First of all I want to let you know about the freebie that we just talked about from the girl Theo does she has a freebie called Five Ways to have a more captivating feed and I'm sharing that link in today's show notes. So all you do is head over to grow means business dot.com forward slash episode thirty eight and you can grab that free download while you're there. I've got a couple other free downloads I want you to check out. One is my free marketing guide.


These are five tried and true marketing strategies that I have used in my business to grow my following grow my email list get my name out there and build that know like and trust factor with my followers. You can also download your free lead magnet template. This is a done for you template. All you have to do is fill in your lead magnet information. It's through Canada. It's simple it's easy it's really nice and professional looking and it is yours completely free. The third free thing I have for you is your branding guide workbook.


Building a brand workbook. This is a free work both that you can download and walks you through all the steps that you need to build a brand that your clients will recognize love and want to work with. So all you have to do is head over to Today Show notes a girl means business dot.com forward slash episode thirty eight and grab all those incredible freebies from myself as well as Charlie's with the girl at the yellow desk. So again head over to grow means business. Dot.com forward slash Episode 38 and grab all those freebies today.


All right guys let's get back to this incredible interview and then so let's get to the next tip.


Let's talk about one's favorite hashtags. So one of the announcements that was made about hashtags from Instagram headquarters themselves was that even though they allow 30 hashtags which was how a lot of us were hashtag before you get better engagement and you'll get better algorithm recognition. If you only do like five to seven mats and some people are only using as little as three hashtags. So why only a little while. They also said that they're using technology that recognizes your photos. So if you post a picture of your dog. But do hashtag like ballet for a hairstylist.


We're gonna go back to that example. It might not recognize the algorithm might not recognize why a dog has ballet and want to keep the picture at the forefront of people's feeds. So what we want to do when we post a picture of our dog like my dog. I would do hashtag French bulldog has a hashtag for use of Instagram. Yeah it does exactly pertain to my business but it's part of my cohesive feed and the hashtag relates to the picture. So we want the hashtag to relate to the picture but also to our industry.


So that also helps people decide on the link of what they're going to be posting because if you are only posting dog pics you're never gonna get a link to your ideal client who's looking for a virtual assistant or a hairstylist or whatever that you're posting. So those hashtags now we can all be relieved. The two rules are stick between three to seven and they have to be relevant to the picture. Thirdly I will say do not post the same ones over and over and over again you will be penalized on the algorithm.


Your pictures will start to show up less and feeds and eventually you can end up on Instagram jail where they stop showing your pictures altogether if you continue to use it because they're trying to get rid of bots and bots use the same Instagram captions over and over and they search the same captions to you know basically they're hacking people and they're going in and taking their information. So we want to stay out of Instagram jail and we want to get our ideal clients by following those hashtag rules.


Yes. OK. Follow up on the hashtag question do you recommend posting those in the actual post. Or do you prefer to put that in a comment. So it kind of gets buried.


I used to do it in the comment up until very recently but one of the articles I was reading from Instagram headquarters and I can't remember the exact reason why so I apologize but it did say that burying it in the comment I think has more to do with them thinking it's a about commenting.


So now we want to put it at the bottom of our feed and if this thing is as if you are if you cannot guess or you can post organically in real time which a lot of people do.


And unfortunately when you post on the platform your hashtags are right there underneath your your caption it doesn't matter because you're only doing three to five. So now it's no longer this long list of 30 things that I don't want to look at. And then if you're using create or played with creator on Facebook when I did Instagram it does allow for space breaks. So it will put it a little further down as well. So whichever way that you prefer it doesn't matter 3 to 7 and people are gonna get used to seeing that very quickly and it's short.


OK so I did I'm going to go back so quick. When we talked about the planning apps you mentioned that they prefer organic from your phone versus planner. So right now I'm using a program called Smarter cube. I just started using it and so it sends me it pushes a notification to my phone so it doesn't post directly to Instagram and it does right. I only know that it will too. I think it will the Facebook but I don't ever have it do that. So it pushes the notification and then I copy and paste and put it on.


Is that what you're saying is still OK. Yeah that way. OK. Because it like it's organically coming from your phone anyway. It is. Yeah. You're just using it and later has that same option.


I don't know about the others they might but I've worked mostly with later for my clients. So now we want to be able to log in and have it push and you do it yourself and that way.


Instagram is favoring those people who posts from their platform the most.


Scuse me. Yeah. Because I use later and I still use it. I'm kind of making the transition over to smarter Q Switching because smarter Q also allows you to post into Facebook groups and that's what I was trying to use it for. Also I loved later later been awesome. Another thing I heard kind of going back to that same area of questioning is that I could be wrong on this but they were saying that when you post for example you can notification from later and it says you have a scheduled post you open it up copy it open up Instagram.


I had read somewhere or heard somewhere that if you even slightly edit the photo using the Instagram editor whether it's with a filter or with their editing options that that helps maybe boost a little bit. Just because it's showing Instagram that youre interacting with the form within editing a photo within their app to have you heard anything about that.


Actually I have not heard anything about that. So right now I think that might be false information unless someone has tested it themselves and given you that and said it worked for them. I have not heard that whatsoever in fact and my tips for cohesive feed. I go into exactly what I used to edit my photos to get them to look the way they do so and I don't use Instagram.


Yeah I tried it a couple of times with few posts where I could just adjust a little bit of the exposure or the contrast just to slightly to kind of give it a little extra boost and I didn't notice much of a difference. So OK. I just want to throw it out there and see. Yeah you should.


And you know I'm going to maybe look into that when we get off this call so I can see if there is any weight to that. But from Instagram headquarters there was no mention of that. And so if it saves me time to not do that I'm not going to do it. Yeah. No I agree. OK. So what's there next to one another tip is our response time. So we want to respond pretty quickly after either we see someone put up a post and we want to be within their comment within their comments.


We want to comment quickly especially to keep seeing them on our feed but also maybe for other people to see our comment and be saved by the algorithm in general and then when people respond to our comments we really want to be able to respond back.


So I would say it's the first hour is the most ideal. So if you are posting even through an outside source like Facebook reader to your Instagram you want to give yourself a window of time that you don't post it like 5:00 in the morning when you're not up until 7:00 because then you're gonna wake up have all these comments and it'll be a couple hours old so that's good that you get to still interact with people. But if you're talking about the algorithm it's not helping. Now since we are talking about building an organic feed that no matter when people comment always respond back and always use at least three words and not just emojis.


I was once in a group where we were all supposed to be helping each other on Instagram so we were in this little Instagram group and soon as someone would post someone say posted and then we'd all go and these women were just giving like Hearts and I finally got to the group because I told them I said hey please listen to me we have to do real comments not like hey nice. That's beautiful. Like a real organic truly met. From your heart post and there's no reason why we can't do that when you see the people that you follow you should be following people you like.


So when they post something you should honestly be able to say wow thank you for that tip or wow your kid is so beautiful or what. Congratulations on your engagement. We should be feeling that way and able to say those things and that's what Instagram wants from us is to be connecting with people and that's what people want from us. So then our brand gets noticed and our personality gets noticed more and they form these friendships that turn into long lasting clients as well later on for us.


Yeah I say all the time you have to be social on social media if you're not social. Then you're just marketing and that's not going to work for your business.


You have to go and I think what you said especially about not just responding to people's comments on your posts but going in and actually leaving organic comments on other people's post that I've been really trying hard. It's so easy just to double tap and move on double time and move on. But to actually go in and leave a meaningful comment and say something on somebody other than just your sister your best friend. But the people that you want to have more engagement with you have to be more engaging with them too.


It's a lot like you know if you have a friend in real life that you are upset with because you like we never get together we never see each other but you're also never reaching out to schedule something. It's the same exact thing if you're never commenting and then gauging with their content you can't expect the same in return.


Absolutely you said it better than I could have given said it. That's absolutely perfect. Yup. And also you know since Instagram is going to be removing their likes feature you still are gonna be able to like and people will be able to. You'll be able to see personally the but it's going to become something kind of of the past where we don't really care about the likes.


And so if you're just so used to double tapping and liking it's not doing anything for any. It's actually almost like a waste of your time to even double tap. Once this goes into effect here in the United States. So we should all just be getting used to writing at least three word organic truthful comments. And if you know that age old adage if you don't have nothing something nice to say don't say it at all. Absolutely be truthful to yourself. Don't comment fake comments if you don't mean them.


Yeah but I'm glad you brought up the like thing because I was gonna ask you about that. I've been seeing it going around so I know they're rolling out like the testing like some people I guess or they've tried it out on.


I love this idea I don't know something you're kind of on the fence about it. I love the fact that they're to that they want to take that away. I think that not only for just mental health reasons people that you know it's become such a big thing and I think a lot of it having two daughters and they're gonna grow up in an age where they're going to feel like they their validation comes from how many likes they get on social media. But I absolutely love this. So I wanted to ask you your thoughts on it as well.


Sure. I feel the same way that you do. I don't have daughters but I grew up as a teenager who was very insecure like most of us. That awkward phase and then maybe beyond. And if I had been in a time where all of my self-esteem revolved around how many people liked my pictures I think it would have been even harder. I can't even imagine what these girls are going through. And so that was their main motivation. But if we can be honest as adults we sometimes do get obsessed with the likes to look only because we're putting so much hard work into our social media feeds to get more clientele or whatever reasons.


And then we look down and we're like nobody even cared. And it can affect us as entrepreneurs that I always called the roller coaster ride. One day you wake up you know like I love what I do and then like an hour later you'll like I hate this I'm quitting I'm going to go get a job at Walmart. But that kind of makes our emotional roller coaster worse as well. So what I've learned is and some of the best mindset advice I was given anyway was that it doesn't matter.


You post whether or not you don't get a single leg or comment. You show up and that consistency we talked about for you every single day and you test different things out to see what your audience likes but you don't quit or based anything in your life on whether or not you got the lakes.


So if you're really in that mindset the like thing won't even matter. I don't even check to see who like my photos. I don't even care. Yeah I care about the people who want to engage with me who want to answer the people who drop into my arms and say like Hey I liked your post or what do you do for work and just want to get to know me. And that's where the real friendships and engagement and helping each other is actually happening. So the lakes keep going for all I personally care permanently altogether and I wouldn't even care.


Yeah I agree. Because I notice the like we'll still be able to see how he likes our photos get but nobody else. It won't be directly between the bills but underneath that we have those photos. And I think for me like again like you said I didn't really look at my likes a whole lot unless I'm going back to see which photos perform right is the best way but I do look at like other people sometimes. And I think like Oh man well there are photos so amazing and they've got all these likes and we started and this and that it's the comparison part of it.


I'm so glad they're getting rid of. And then for me I just in the past year it was just this mindset shift of not so much the likes that I focused more on the comments even without looking at my analytics I would base what content was giving was the most valuable content based on how many people interacted with it with comments. And that's more important to me anyway. Like you mentioned the engagement aspect of it. And so I think it's a really great shift. I'm super excited about it coming out like across the board.


I'm ready for I want it to happen. I know I wish it happened too.


And other thing I just realized and I might be behind and I'll admit that I don't know everything even though sometimes I like to think I do something that I didn't know that Instagram had until recently was the option to turn off the potential for negative comments. So you go into your settings under commenting and you can actually toggle off. And so if they see a comment that looks like bullying or negative they won't even let it show on your feet. So that's an additional feature that Instagram has put out for us.


I mean I'm not subject to that yet but you know they say the larger that you get more fans that you get the more people following you those Instagram and other internet trolls that are just kind of those bullies probably still from high school that never grew up or are still going on they're saying mean things. And so Instagram just wants to take that away from everybody. But I know that they're focusing on that teen age group. So that really warms my heart to know that if you can turn that feature off for your teenage daughters or younger they're never going to they may never have to see those horrible bullying comments that have led to some teen suicides and other awful things over the years.


That's amazing I had no idea you could do that. That's incredible. Yeah it's under so my goodness settings. Yeah. OK. And settings. OK. So you have one more tip for us correct.


Yes my favorite tip is to connect with people through direct messages. Now of course we want to stop this creepy Head Girl DMD to strangers. You don't want to like go on and say hey girl do you want to buy my mai whatever. Or hey girl you're cute because those are awful. But what I do is systematically go in about once a week and look to see who followed me. That's new. And I send them a voice message thanking them for following me asking if there's anything they need and complimenting them on something after I've gone through their feed.


I'm just trying to start friendships because you never know who you're going to meet out there and how they're going to lead to another step in your life even if they never become an actual paying client. And that takes about 15 minutes of my day and I love it. I have gotten the best results people have come back to me and helped me with my marketing people have given me answers for different things that I could do to help them and them help me back. You just even just a positive message for the day that you connected with somebody and help them which is why I'm here.


So I recommend direct messaging people because keeps them on the platform so Instagram's happy about that. Then you end up meeting people all around. It's really good. It's just we do have to get over our fear of those mediums. So we want to make sure we're not the person doing that.


And again like with the like principle if no one writes us back or messages us back it doesn't hurt our feelings but we're just.


I'm personally out there to give to everybody until they all feel my support from women empowering women. So I go to those women. I thank them for following me and if I get nothing back fine. But guess what I have gotten the love back.


Yeah. You'd be surprised. It's amazing how just something like that can make someone's day and like you said I've gone back and I've done a whole episode on this about my number one marketing tip of all times is always going to be give more than you expect in return. Same deal that falls right into that because and I just recently I've kind of gotten into the voice messaging part because I hate honestly typing on my phone. There's a part of me that's like man I wish I could just type of DRM on my my laptop because it is so much easier it takes forever but the voice memo part is awesome and it's so much more personal because I can hear your voice you can personalize it to them.


And I don't know maybe you know this but do you get flagged. Look I know Instagram flagship you send out to many Dems in a certain amount of time. Does it do the same if it's with a voice memo or is that kind of fly under the radar for them.


No I think it does the same thing but keep in mind that I am direct messaging people that are following me so I'm not direct messaging strangers to ask them to like me. I'm going after people who already are following me to thank them. So I think that's the difference. If you direct message to many people at once then it will it will flag you now though the insisting that you're speaking to so I will speak to like one there's one like difference that a lot of people will send the same message over and over through direct message and then we'll flag that that is only flags or typing but I don't have a prerecorded voice memo send it over and over again.


So I'm not going to get flagged for that it's literally personal to each person. So yes. So sending out too many direct messages at one time with the same verbiage will flag you. I don't know the number it changes for different people over 25 or 30 I've heard different numbers. I've heard seven once I heard seven and then you lost lives.


So I think it depends on how quickly you're saying that because it happened to me one time and I can't refuse Instagram or Facebook and I wasn't copying and knowing that I was copying pasting I think because it was like sending info to people that had requested info from me and I was just kind of doing it all at once and I was personalizing it with their name but I think it's because I did it so quickly that like within a matter of five minutes I'd set you know X amount of messages and to the people behind Facebook Instagram they were like oh must be a bot.


So I think that was what it was. I think if you spread it out a little bit and said you were doing the voice memo thing to speak to one thing were quick to because I guarantee you some listings going.


I don't have one more thing I have to add to my list but I will say this. So I'm a huge huge fan of jasmine Starr and she's incredible and I set her IDM one time after she launched her podcast. Yes I've asked her a question which her podcast is incredible. If you haven't listened to the Jasmine star after you listen to this one posit go with the terms. I listened to her first couple episodes I sent her a DMA I just said Oh my God I'm loving your podcast. I think I mentioned something and then I asked a question about something she had.


There was an episode where she did an interview with her her business coach or one of one of her mentors and I asked a question about something she had said in there that revolved around I think like a fear around started the podcast this and that and a fear around starting social curator and she came back the next day with less than 24 hours and I had to voice memos from her and I about died. I was like oh my god jesus this sent me a lovely graph. She can drive a bit and everything.


I took a screenshot of the little notification on my phone where it said Jasmine SA sent you a voice message. But the fact that like she is someone who has so many followers I can I can only imagine how many D.M. she gets in a day. I can only imagine how many new followers she gets if and how busy she is. I mean she run this incredible business she's got the podcast like she's got all the stuff going on. If she can take the time out of her day to send little old me a voice message to not only thank me for taking the time to do message her but to answer the question I had then I think we can all take a few minutes at the same thing for somebody else because you never know when the excitement that I felt when Jasmine messaged me you could give somebody else that same excitement.


You never know how you're going to impact somebody else's day. So I love this. I mean all your tips have been amazing with that might be my favorite because I know I don't utilize DMV enough. I need to start doing that more because it does make a big impact. It just extends that personal connection. I think if Jasmine star might that said this but like your Instagram feed is like the cocktail party where you meet people and your D M is like the coffee date that you go on with the new friend you met at the cocktail party right.


Absolutely. And you know we have to remember that she's actually an introvert. And so when she pushes herself to do that to me that's even more amazing. Yeah. On her blog her podcast I believe it's the one that dropped on the 11th of November. On one of her recent ones. She mentions that she wakes up at 5:00 a.m. for thirty a.m. she can spend a half hour replying to all of her messages personally she's done it since day one and she's not stopping or delegating yet. And I think that's.


Amazing. So you know again by delegating there are certain things that are personal that we're going to want to keep for ourselves even though we delegate and I love that she wants to keep that because she knows that serves not only her purpose well but her business as well. So I agree with you. We can take 15 minutes a day and we can reach out to the people who have gone out of their way to follow us.


I agree. Again it's well like I said earlier she's doing the thing that only she can do which I perfect.


Yeah well I want to copy her in every way so I do all right.


I just adore her. I chic and yeah she I mean every time I hear her speak and the fact that she's an introvert I'm just like that's I'm not an introvert necessarily I have the tendencies. But the fact that she's done everything that she's done and the fear behind all of it I'm sure for her is amazing. Yep OK. Well these have been incredible. I feel like that we just rocked this Instagram episode so many good taps. So my last question for you because I had some others what I think we hit all of them because this is about this is the podcast for women who are in business and you have clearly started you know both business and through the hair business and then what you're doing now.


What advice would you give to somebody who is brand new who's just starting about creating a business or has just gotten in to the world of entrepreneurship.


What advice do you have for her my simplest but advice for someone like that is don't give up and whatever you need to do for yourself to figure out how to keep from giving up whether that's investing in a mindset coach I've done that it's helped keeping yourself surrounded by people who are supporting you and discarding those temporarily who do not. Keeping your Instagram fault like who you follow full of positive quotes and people who are doing what you want to do whatever is going to motivate you to stop not give up because like we said earlier it's a roller coaster ride.


And I think all of us entrepreneurs want to give up at least once a day usually for even just a second. And I always have in my head like that's going to be a greater Walmart. You know I keep thinking about the blue vest but the truth is and by the way I don't really like Walmart so that's a really big. That's a really big deal when I get to that point. But anyway that being said if I had given up and there were times I'll be dead honest with you and your and our listeners today I know there were times in the beauty industry where I kind of gave up on some of my dreams thinking they were too big and put them to the side for later.


And I think to myself I don't have regrets but I think to myself Well where would I have been if I would have followed that path that I was a little too afraid or someone told me. Don't try it. So in this you know incarnation of my new career this life that I'm following now this path I am not going to give up whatever my dream is going to keep pushing and pushing and pushing and sometimes that doesn't lead down the path you thought. But you still keep walking and you still keep finding where it leads.


And I think it's going to be amazing for each of us to find out where our path goes.


That's so good. And not to keep coming back to Desert start but something you said may think of one of her recent episodes I just listened to where she talked about fear and how she will choose fear every time because that's where she knows the good stuff is that's where you grow and the best things come out of fear if you're playing and safe and you don't have any fears and then you're not you're not pushing yourself enough. So I think that's really amazing and we all have those big dreams. I know we all do.


And so we just don't give up on them. I love it. Yes I think I have quit this business multiple times the day before. We're all in that boat together right. So tell us where people can find you. I'm sure after this we're going to be like Oh my God I need to know more about this amazing woman. So where can people find you. How can they follow you where can they get your information.


Sure. Well first of all I'm always on Instagram guilty always on it. So even follow me my handle is girl at the yellow desk on Instagram also on Facebook I'm not in there as often but I will be bumping that up soon. I also have a Web site girl at the yellow desk dot com and I have some blogs that I'm starting all about. In fact if you go to girl at the yellow desk dot com slash blog. I have a blog post coming up that's going to talk again about these tips and offer a freebie with a month of Instagram prompts just to help people out with getting those creative juices flowing especially through this busy holiday season and starting with Q1.


So definitely head over to my blog to get all the freebies that you can get to help you and any other questions you have. I always answer my desire and I'm always available to check with you about hirings. I can take care of your social media for you. It's on the delegate list that you don't want to do. I'm here for you.


Awesome and I'm going to repeat what you said one more time because I want everybody to hear that you are offering them a month of free Instagram captions that what you said I want to clarify. That's amazing. CAPTION prompts yes.


OK starters for them because they should personalize them themselves that it will be thirty one prompts that are going to be in that freebie for my next blog post. So you're going to want to head over read that article with more tips and get that freebie so great and all of this will be linked in the show.


So anybody you don't have to remember everything she just said just head to the show notes and they'll all be linked right there so you can grab the five ways to have more captivating feed that freebie the blog post you get the other freebie with the thirty one prompts and then all of your Web site Instagram Facebook handles will all be there as well so they can check you out. Thank you so much for chatting me today. This has been so good. Oh my gosh so much great information. I feel like now I have I'm going to listen to this a couple of times myself because I feel like I need to like read some of this into what I'm doing so thank you.


I really appreciate you taking the time to chat to me. I hope you have a wonderful week and enjoy the holidays. Thank you so much. You as well. All right we'll talk to you soon. OK bye.


I don't know if you've noticed a trend when I do these interviews but sometimes I get so caught up in just having a conversation with another incredible boss babe that time flies by. And the next thing you know these interviews are running kind of long but hopefully they are getting really valuable content for you I want to make sure that even though they are a little bit longer episodes that you are getting tons and tons of value and I feel like this episode was so packed full of amazing information with Instagram and I want you to head over to the girl means business Facebook group.


If you haven't joined yet just head to Facebook. Type in girl means business and you should see the group pull up ask to join and let's have a conversation around these tips are you using them. Are you seeing results do you have more questions that you want answered. I'd be happy to even maybe invite Charlies on for a Instagram overhaul kind of quick tips in the Facebook group. So let me know what you think I want to definitely hear your feedback. And don't forget to head over to iTunes. Leave me a quick review so that I can send you a special thank you gift just for the holidays in the mail and make sure you tune in next week because I have an extra special episode coming to you where I roundup our best and favorite episodes from 20 19 so hit subscribe so you don't miss out on that.


It'll be great listening for all those long road trips to visit family and friends over the holidays. All right guys have a great week and I'll see you back here same time same place.


If you love today's episode don't forget to click the subscribe button so you never miss when a new episode goes live. Then head over to iTunes and leave a quick review to let the people know just how much you loved it. Thanks ladies. See you next week.



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